Frame VIN # on P7 to P8 ECU Change-over?

mrc.engr

Hey Guys,

Anyone know what at what year and frame # (VIN) did Ducati switch from the P7 ECU to the P8 ECU?

Thanks...... Mike

racerx

My chart only shows P7 through '93 888's and P8 for 916's in '94......but I'm sure you knew that!

johnboy888

My '94 888 Strada with ZDM1JB4RXRB002429 has a P8.

Cheers,
John

johnboy888

Mike, I found some information saying P8's were used from 000509, see this link.

Cheers,
John

henk

johnboy888 wroteMy '84 888 Strada with ZDM1JB4RXRB002429 has a P8. Cheers, John

A '84 strada,that has to be very rare. 😄
Mine '94 888 has a P8 as well just like my '94 916.
gonna have a look for the frame number.

Henk!!!

johnboy888

henk wroteA '84 strada,that has to be very rare. 😄 Mine '94 888 has a P8 as well just like my '94 916. gonna have a look for the frame number. Henk!!!

Upgraded to 94 now :-)

mrc.engr

johnboy888 wroteMike, I found some information saying P8's were used from 000509, see this link. Cheers, John

Hello John........ this is the information I must have seen years ago. The problem is these frame #'s are too low.

Weber-Marelli IAW P7 ECU
851, 907 and early 888's up to serial number 000508.

For instance my (very early USA) 1990 851 is frame #1243 that has a P7

With this I'm thinking the change-over point is actually frame # 1508 (anthing below thiis has P7)........and from frame # 1509 up is all P8 ECU's.

With this said I'm thinking the change over model (for the USA) was the 1992 851.

Thanks for your thoughts and comments. Always appreciated.

My best ............Mike

mrc.engr

henk wroteA '84 strada,that has to be very rare. 😄 Mine '94 888 has a P8 as well just like my '94 916. gonna have a look for the frame number. Henk!!!

We don't see the 888 Strada in the USA. All of our 888's for 93 & 94 were SP5's with the USA 888 Strada 100 rwhp engine.

Cheers...........Mike

BABA

No 851 had a P8.
The changing is for frame #000508 for 888 strada and SPO (corresponding to earlier '93 bikes) and all SP5 (888 SPO, what you have in US is not an SP5).
All previous bikes used a P7.
So it's perfectly normal that you have a P7 on your '90 bike.

brad black

851 is a different frame # series to 888. 851 strada got close to or over 4000, then 888 started again at 0001.

mrc.engr

BABA wroteNo 851 had a P8. The changing is for frame #000508 for 888 strada and SPO (corresponding to earlier '93 bikes) and all SP5 (888 SPO, what you have in US is not an SP5). All previous bikes used a P7. So it's perfectly normal that you have a P7 on your '90 bike.

Perhaps in Europe no 851 came with P8, but here in the states the very last of the 851's (late 1992) the USA got had P8's installed from the factory.

Fwiw........the only difference between the USA SPO and the SP5 was the state of motor tune. The SPO was single injector per cylinder with 100 rwhp strada motor. The SP5 was dual injector per cylinder with 118 rwhp (semi corsa motor). All other equipment and features were identicale.

If you know of any other differences, decals and stickers aside, please enumerate.

Thanks..........Mike

mrc.engr

BABA wroteNo 851 had a P8. The changing is for frame #000508 for 888 strada and SPO (corresponding to earlier '93 bikes) and all SP5 (888 SPO, what you have in US is not an SP5). All previous bikes used a P7. So it's perfectly normal that you have a P7 on your '90 bike.

brad black wrote851 is a different frame # series to 888. 851 strada got close to or over 4000, then 888 started again at 0001.

Very interesting Brad. This implies that only the 888 got the P8 ECU and it started with frame # 509.
Thanks for this new information.

If anyone else has a second or third alternative and reliable source that supports or alters this please chime in so we can get to the bottom of all this.

Thank you very much........ Mike

mrc.engr

racerx wroteMy chart only shows P7 through '93 888's and P8 for 916's in '94......but I'm sure you knew that!

What "chart" are you referring to?

Please scan it or take a photo of it and post it here so we can see it.

Thanks..........MIke

henk

Fwiw........the only difference between the USA SPO and the SP5 was the state of motor tune. The SPO was single injector per cylinder with 100 rwhp strada motor. The SP5 was dual injector per cylinder with 118 rwhp (semi corsa motor). All other equipment and features were identicale.

If you know of any other differences, decals and stickers aside, please enumerate.

Thanks..........Mike[/QUOTE]

The color of the bottom of the fork.
On a SPO,grey like a strada.
On a SP5 "gold".

Henk!!!

mrc.engr

Quite true Henk.........the SP5 Showa fork lowers are bronze colored and the strada's are silver. Some might think this means the SP5 forks are special, but they aren't........they are the exact same bronze lowers forks Ducati put on the 900SS.

I have both here at the shop and have taken them apart to see if anything is different. Zero differences except the 900SS has 8.5 kg/cm springs vs 9.0 in the SP5.

All in all the SP5 was a "bitsa" & whatever parts they had left-over final 888 run bike. Kinda sad when you consider what the 888 achieved for Ducati. It should have had (at least) the CF tank & Ohlins forks.

My best............Mike

mrc.engr

From Brian Brown on the 851/888 List

All good points Brian.

As usual....... Ducati has taken something simple and turned it into a cluster.

Thanks........ Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Brown

You also have to take into account the different chassis number configurations that Ducati used on the bikes.

Take a look at the Micapeak 851/888 registry.

All of the USA specification bikes (no Corsa or SP2/3/4/5) will have 17 digit chassis numbers, that do not specify if it is an 851 or 888 and have a year
(10th digit) indicator. After that year is over, the numbers start at one again.

For example, I used to own Bimota Mantra chassis number 0004, and for sure it was not the fourth Bimota ever made. It was just the 4th USA Specification Bimota that was made in 1996.

The European and Australian Strada 851/888 have a 14 digit chassis number with and 851/888 prefix. The 851 Kit, SP2/3/4/5 and Corsa have a 13 digit chassis number also with an 851/888 prefix.

So I don't know if you can say for sure when the P7/P8 change happened using the chassis number.

Brian Brown

ps...........some of you might not know there's a 851/888 Yahoo List that's the grand daddy of 851/888 information exchange for almost 20 yrs now. Low noise to info ratio........ no spam.

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BABA

I don't agree with that.
exemple from the micapeak registery.
First SPO I saw :
ZDM1HB7R3PB000509

There is less than 500 SPO product (290 in 1993, 100 in 1994).
So it is well using the sequential number of strada same as in europe and other part of the world.
You have a designation for the model, and a letter for the year. But the frame number follow the others.

http://www.vin-decoder.org/details?vin=ZDM1HB7R3PB000509

They just change the way to identify the bike, depending of the country (for us, a strada is a frame ZDM888S1, but we haven't precision about the year)
The frame #509 with strada designation was used to built an SPO in 1993.
Same for the "strada" frame #645, it's an SPO.

mrc.engr wroteFwiw........the only difference between the USA SPO and the SP5 was the state of motor tune. The SPO was single injector per cylinder with 100 rwhp strada motor. The SP5 was dual injector per cylinder with 118 rwhp (semi corsa motor). All other equipment and features were identicale.

A better engine with dual injection and 50mm exhaust, front fork (ok not a big difference, but the engine is😉), I'm not sure, but I think SPO didn't have the iron flotting discs, and the rear frame is in steel not aluminium as on SP5.
But SPO is what a strada Superbike should be... a monoposto 😁

mrc.engr

Keeping on topic....... as we try to determine at what point in frame numbers did Ducati change from the P7 ECU to the P8 ECU. We seem to be zeroing in (until more information comes to light) 888 frame (VIN) 508 as the last P7 ECU and 509 was the first P8 ECU.

Off topic....... is the few differences between the (USA) SPO and the SP5. Yes, there is a considerable difference in the state of tune of the engines. One having 100 rwhp (strada, single injector vs SP5 (which got the SPS 118 rwhp) dual injector motor.......but you can't see this engine difference as you stand next to each bike.

Which motor is "better" is clearly debatable. The SPO strada engine is much more suited to normal road going and everyday use. The much more radical SP5 is more suited for spirited open road and track use.

Do note, the SPS/SP5 motor had a major flaw in one of the main bearings (low friction) design that was used in the SPS motor as the SPS motor was a major copy of the 91 spec Corsa motor. If left unattended the "low friction" main bearing could and did fail causing considerable engine damage. The "fix" for this issue (implemented for the 94 Corsa motor) was to use the 888 Strada designed main bearing. In this respect the SPO strada motor is a better motor as the cases are stronger and will last longer under spirited use.

Overall.....the differences are as you point out:
SPO had stainless steel rotors. The SP5 had cast iron.
SPO had steel rear (chrome moly?) mono-posto sub-frame. SP5 used alloy mono-posto.
SPO has 100 hp vs SP5 118 hp.

This said, I am to this day still quite I disappointed that Ducati using ordinary strada parts for the final 888 SP.

1. The iconic class Ohlins forks are gone on the SP5. Instead Ducati fitted strada Showa forks that came on the air cooled 2 valve 900SS.

2. The SP5 has a steel gas tank......not the exotic carbon fiber tank of the SPS or wonderful alloy tank other SP's got......but a plain (heavy) steel gas tank.

Both of these losses on the SP5 are wrong in my book.

These items pointed out, I think there is remarkable similarities between the SPO and the SP5...... to the point where unless you are well versed in 888 construction, you can't tell the difference between the SPO vs SP5 until you get right up on each. The average person certainly can't.

In conclusion, to my original point on the SPO VS SP5 is that they are very much alike in most respects. Frankly, even as one who knows the differences intimately from across a car park I would be hard pressed to tell one from the other. On the other hand I can tell a SP2--SP4 from a considerable distance even without my glasses.

My best..........Mike

Foggy 888

[QUOTE=BABA;64164]I don't agree with that.
exemple from the micapeak registery.
First SPO I saw :
ZDM1HB7R3PB000509

There is less than 500 SPO product (290 in 1993, 100 in 1994).

The VIN number would correspond to the total number of all Ducati's sold in the USA in 1993. All 1993 Monsters, 900SS, and 888 SPO have the same VIN configuration.

So that particular motorcycle would be the 509th Ducati sold in the USA in 1993. Ducati sold more than 509 motorcycles in the USA in 1993.

Brian Brown

BABA

Ok 😄

mrc.engr wroteWe seem to be zeroing in (until more information comes to light) 888 frame (VIN) 508 as the last P7 ECU and 509 was the first P8 ECU.

Changing at #508 😁
#507 with P7.
#508 with P8.